Went to buy a fishing reel and...

BERZERKER-JEEP · 03-26-2007, 09:13 PM

I ended up being towed home. I went down to my favourite fishing store about 30 km away, and had to call CAA to get home.

Let me start by saying it is a 93 GC with an I6 and 242. The truck started up, and drove down there just fine. I bought my reel ( shimano stradic for all you fisherman ) and I jumped back in and went to start it up. The jeep would hardly start, it sounded as though it wasn't getting enough fuel. My battery is fine, and I looked into my air filter, and it was pretty clean as well, other than some oil marks from a line that came from the top of the engine directly into the cover for the air filter (if someone could tell me what this is called and its function I would appreciate it). So I am sitting there waiting for the tow truck and I came up with the idea that it could either be:
a) a bad fuel pump
b) a clogged fuel filter
c) something wrong with my fuel injection

As I tried to start it, the RPM's were between 0 and about 100, and it sounded like it was barely running. After I had turned it off, I tried to start it again but it wouldn't even "barely run" like it had before when I had first started it. All it did after that was try to turn over but nothing happened. A guy that was close by told me also that it sounded like it wasn't getting enough fuel.

So, as it stands now the jeep is sitting in my driveway, with no way of getting it started. I am a student and use the car to commute to school, so I would like to have it fixed asap. I am wondering if anyone has had a similar issue, and if it was hard to fix. Also, if I am way off with the fuel idea please let me know because I am going to start by changing the fuel filter tomorrow and see if that gets me anywhere. Thanks in advance guys!

BERZERKER-JEEP · 03-27-2007, 09:30 PM

Bump...no body has any ideas?

rawannam · 03-27-2007, 09:50 PM

Wouldn't hurt to switch out the fuel filter, its a 10 minute job and couldn't hurt. Had on go bad on me in my XJ. If that doesn't help then you know the problem is somewhere else, are you sure its not getting fuel? Could also be the ignition, such as the coil...Did it throw any codes?

kjk · 03-27-2007, 10:02 PM

My money is on the battery. I know you said it cranks but it might be so weak that there is not enough voltage to run the computer and ignition very well.
I went out on an errand with a perfectly healthy (seemingly) battery and when I came out of the store it was stone dead.
Borrow a good one and try it. It's free...

BERZERKER-JEEP · 03-27-2007, 10:03 PM

I do not know how to check if it throws codes or not. I am going to see if I can get a pressure gauge for the valve on the fuel rail. I think that will give me a good idea of what it is. I think that I will change the filter anyways, but I do not want to shell out the money for a pump if I don't need one. I took off a wire from the plug and tried to start it, and there was a spark. I am pretty confident that the ignition is good. It just happened suddenly, and all of the stories I have heard about a fuel pump have been gradual. So I am still in the dark here, I guess I will give the filter a try and go from there. Any other advice would be great. Thanks a lot rawannam

BERZERKER-JEEP · 03-27-2007, 10:14 PM

kjk, At first this is what I thought as well. I actually had a guy with a newer explorer hook up to mine and give me a jump. I also saw the meter go to about 14 volts on the dash when I was trying to crank it. I may try a different battery, I hope that you are right and that is the case.

kjk · 03-27-2007, 10:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BERZERKER-JEEP

I do not know how to check if it throws codes or not.

On that year you might be able to check the codes by turning the key in some sequence and have the check engine light flash them. It would be very helpful to try and check for a code first.
If no codes show I would suspect the battery or others have had a bad connection at the ECU give them problems. Corrosion or a loose connection here can do weird things. Just because the connector is bolted up doesn't mean all is well. Sometimes undoing the connector and reattaching it can make the connection good again (temporarily anyway). Another free thing to check!

rawannam · 03-27-2007, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kjk

On that year you might be able to check the codes by turning the key in some sequence and have the check engine light flash them. It would be very helpful to try and check for a code first.
If no codes show I would suspect the battery or others have had a bad connection at the ECU give them problems. Corrosion or a loose connection here can do weird things. Just because the connector is bolted up doesn't mean all is well. Sometimes undoing the connector and reattaching it can make the connection good again (temporarily anyway). Another free thing to check!

I have to agree, thats what happened to my 5.9 when the battery died, although it would start and idle fine once started, but the connection seemed loose, worth a shot, I know when I unhhoked the cables and retightened everything it bought me an extra week or 2.

BERZERKER-JEEP · 03-27-2007, 10:36 PM

Ok, I will have to try that tomorrow. I am still going to see if I can pick up a fuel filter because those are pretty cheap. I will try to borrow a fuel pressure gauge and see. I have no leak in my fuel line, so if the pressure isn't correct the main problem must be the pump right? Ah what a headache, thanks for the help!

02 Grand · 03-27-2007, 11:31 PM

x how ever many on the battery. I have replaced mine twice now. Both time ran fine to the store and was stone dead when I came back out. Tried to jump it and it was all I could do to keep it running. New battery and it was back to normal each time.

Good luck.

horkn · 03-28-2007, 12:24 AM

sounds like the battery to me as well

hopefully thats it. its easy, and relatively cheap

jeepkid · 03-28-2007, 02:24 PM

the fuel filter is on the pump in the tank if your gonna pull it out to change you might as well buy a new pump on ebay get a walbro for 99 bucks.. and change it out on an empty tank.. its one of those things to do when your in there..

Sounds like a battery issue.. the Volts are just that you need cranking amps.. take the battery out and take it to an auto parts store to have them checking the cranking amps.. well just have them test the battery.. if its bad buy an optima.. you will want it later on..

rawannam · 03-28-2007, 02:28 PM

The fuel filter was inline on the earlier ZJ's, I think they went to the pump/filter design in 97. Heres the writeup...
http://www.jeepsunlimited.com/forums...d.php?t=552573

But it sounds like a battery to me as well.

jeepkid · 03-28-2007, 03:24 PM

That shows for a 4.0.. are the v8's setup the same way..

BERZERKER-JEEP · 03-28-2007, 06:49 PM

Well I got my battery checked. It definitely isn't the problem. I have narrowed it down to be a fuel issue, and I think it is the pump. I pressed on the fuel rail valve and absolutely no gas came out. It has been sitting since Monday and I have tried to start it a few times. I turned the key to the ON position but not actually trying to crank the motor over. I waited to here a noise for the pump, and nothing. So after figuring out that it is not my battery, and finding absolutely no fuel pressure, I am led to believe it is my fuel pump. Before I shell out the money could someone tell me if this is an accurate assessment or am I way off?

jeepkid · 03-28-2007, 07:14 PM

have you checked a new fuse or relay for the fuel pump.. ?

If you have it would then be the fuel pump..

BERZERKER-JEEP · 03-28-2007, 07:20 PM

jeepkid, I am relatively new to jeeps and I am not all that good with electrical. Could you tell me where this fuse or relay would be, and what I should look for to see if there is something wrong with it. I know that there is a fuse box under the hood and near the passenger door, but how would I know if one is blown? Also, what is a relay and how does it work? Thanks a lot hate to ask so many questions.

jeepkid · 03-28-2007, 07:32 PM

the relay you should hear click or clicking when you turn the key.. it is a 1inx1in lil black box inside the bigger box under the hood.. the fuse is inside near the passenger door.. that you will see is blown if it is.. its a very common sense item.. basically it looks like a wire inside a peice of plastic if its blown its not connected..

Now that i think of it more if you dont hear anything from the back not even a whine im more inclinded to believe the relay or fuse is blown.. the relay i dont know how to check besides replacing it.. you would have to get it and go to an auto parts store and buy a new one and see if that fixes it.. probally under 10 bucks.. the inside cover of the black box under the hood will tell you what is what.. you want the fuel pump one.. it should say fuel on it..

BERZERKER-JEEP · 03-28-2007, 08:58 PM

Jeepkid, I replaced the relay for the fuel pump. I also check all the fuses on the panel in the dash on the passenger side. It did not cure this problem. I am not sure which fuse it is on the panel, but I checked all the ones that I could see and they were all fine. Is it safe to say that it is the pump that is the problem? I realize that it is hard to tell via internet, but I appreciate the help.

BERZERKER-JEEP · 03-29-2007, 04:49 PM

Update. I read the Haynes manual and I am trying to figure out how to read this multimeter while it is on the connector coming from the motor to the fuel pump. I am not sure if it is the pump because when i turn it on I can not hear anything, and I cannot get any reading on my multimeter. I don't know if I am doing anything wrong. Is there a certain way to use these meters? Thanks again..

03-26-2007, 09:13 PM	#1
BERZERKER-JEEP Registered Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 43 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Went to buy a fishing reel and... I ended up being towed home. I went down to my favourite fishing store about 30 km away, and had to call CAA to get home. Let me start by saying it is a 93 GC with an I6 and 242. The truck started up, and drove down there just fine. I bought my reel ( shimano stradic for all you fisherman ) and I jumped back in and went to start it up. The jeep would hardly start, it sounded as though it wasn't getting enough fuel. My battery is fine, and I looked into my air filter, and it was pretty clean as well, other than some oil marks from a line that came from the top of the engine directly into the cover for the air filter (if someone could tell me what this is called and its function I would appreciate it). So I am sitting there waiting for the tow truck and I came up with the idea that it could either be: a) a bad fuel pump b) a clogged fuel filter c) something wrong with my fuel injection As I tried to start it, the RPM's were between 0 and about 100, and it sounded like it was barely running. After I had turned it off, I tried to start it again but it wouldn't even "barely run" like it had before when I had first started it. All it did after that was try to turn over but nothing happened. A guy that was close by told me also that it sounded like it wasn't getting enough fuel. So, as it stands now the jeep is sitting in my driveway, with no way of getting it started. I am a student and use the car to commute to school, so I would like to have it fixed asap. I am wondering if anyone has had a similar issue, and if it was hard to fix. Also, if I am way off with the fuel idea please let me know because I am going to start by changing the fuel filter tomorrow and see if that gets me anywhere. Thanks in advance guys!

03-27-2007, 09:50 PM	#3
rawannam Registered Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Denver CO Posts: 473 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Wouldn't hurt to switch out the fuel filter, its a 10 minute job and couldn't hurt. Had on go bad on me in my XJ. If that doesn't help then you know the problem is somewhere else, are you sure its not getting fuel? Could also be the ignition, such as the coil...Did it throw any codes? __________________ Slate 5.9 02' GMC Sierra Denali QS speedfreaks.net

03-27-2007, 10:02 PM	#4
kjk wine taster Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Dallas, TX Posts: 3,085 Thanks: 1 Thanked 9 Times in 8 Posts	My money is on the battery. I know you said it cranks but it might be so weak that there is not enough voltage to run the computer and ignition very well. I went out on an errand with a perfectly healthy (seemingly) battery and when I came out of the store it was stone dead. Borrow a good one and try it. It's free... __________________ 5.9 ZJ

03-27-2007, 11:31 PM	#10
02 Grand Registered Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: LR, Arkansas Posts: 222 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	x how ever many on the battery. I have replaced mine twice now. Both time ran fine to the store and was stone dead when I came back out. Tried to jump it and it was all I could do to keep it running. New battery and it was back to normal each time. Good luck. __________________ 2005 WK Inferno Red Laredo 4.7 QTII w/ everything except nav. Put in service: 1/12/06 2002 WJ Steel Blue (Gone to a good owner if he would stop putting dents in it.

03-28-2007, 02:24 PM	#12
jeepkid thespeedfreaks.net Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 2,501 Thanks: 9 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	the fuel filter is on the pump in the tank if your gonna pull it out to change you might as well buy a new pump on ebay get a walbro for 99 bucks.. and change it out on an empty tank.. its one of those things to do when your in there.. Sounds like a battery issue.. the Volts are just that you need cranking amps.. take the battery out and take it to an auto parts store to have them checking the cranking amps.. well just have them test the battery.. if its bad buy an optima.. you will want it later on.. __________________ www.thespeedfreaks.net For real tech help

03-27-2007, 09:30 PM	#2
BERZERKER-JEEP Registered Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 43 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Bump...no body has any ideas?

03-27-2007, 10:03 PM	#5
BERZERKER-JEEP Registered Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 43 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I do not know how to check if it throws codes or not. I am going to see if I can get a pressure gauge for the valve on the fuel rail. I think that will give me a good idea of what it is. I think that I will change the filter anyways, but I do not want to shell out the money for a pump if I don't need one. I took off a wire from the plug and tried to start it, and there was a spark. I am pretty confident that the ignition is good. It just happened suddenly, and all of the stories I have heard about a fuel pump have been gradual. So I am still in the dark here, I guess I will give the filter a try and go from there. Any other advice would be great. Thanks a lot rawannam

03-27-2007, 10:14 PM	#6
BERZERKER-JEEP Registered Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 43 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	kjk, At first this is what I thought as well. I actually had a guy with a newer explorer hook up to mine and give me a jump. I also saw the meter go to about 14 volts on the dash when I was trying to crank it. I may try a different battery, I hope that you are right and that is the case.

03-27-2007, 10:36 PM	#9
BERZERKER-JEEP Registered Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 43 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Ok, I will have to try that tomorrow. I am still going to see if I can pick up a fuel filter because those are pretty cheap. I will try to borrow a fuel pressure gauge and see. I have no leak in my fuel line, so if the pressure isn't correct the main problem must be the pump right? Ah what a headache, thanks for the help!

03-28-2007, 02:28 PM	#13
rawannam Registered Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Denver CO Posts: 473 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	The fuel filter was inline on the earlier ZJ's, I think they went to the pump/filter design in 97. Heres the writeup... http://www.jeepsunlimited.com/forums...d.php?t=552573 But it sounds like a battery to me as well. __________________ Slate 5.9 02' GMC Sierra Denali QS speedfreaks.net

03-28-2007, 03:24 PM	#14
jeepkid thespeedfreaks.net Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 2,501 Thanks: 9 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	That shows for a 4.0.. are the v8's setup the same way.. __________________ www.thespeedfreaks.net For real tech help

03-28-2007, 06:49 PM	#15
BERZERKER-JEEP Registered Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 43 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Well I got my battery checked. It definitely isn't the problem. I have narrowed it down to be a fuel issue, and I think it is the pump. I pressed on the fuel rail valve and absolutely no gas came out. It has been sitting since Monday and I have tried to start it a few times. I turned the key to the ON position but not actually trying to crank the motor over. I waited to here a noise for the pump, and nothing. So after figuring out that it is not my battery, and finding absolutely no fuel pressure, I am led to believe it is my fuel pump. Before I shell out the money could someone tell me if this is an accurate assessment or am I way off?

03-28-2007, 07:14 PM	#16
jeepkid thespeedfreaks.net Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 2,501 Thanks: 9 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	have you checked a new fuse or relay for the fuel pump.. ? If you have it would then be the fuel pump.. __________________ www.thespeedfreaks.net For real tech help

03-28-2007, 07:20 PM	#17
BERZERKER-JEEP Registered Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 43 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	jeepkid, I am relatively new to jeeps and I am not all that good with electrical. Could you tell me where this fuse or relay would be, and what I should look for to see if there is something wrong with it. I know that there is a fuse box under the hood and near the passenger door, but how would I know if one is blown? Also, what is a relay and how does it work? Thanks a lot hate to ask so many questions.

03-28-2007, 07:32 PM	#18
jeepkid thespeedfreaks.net Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 2,501 Thanks: 9 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	the relay you should hear click or clicking when you turn the key.. it is a 1inx1in lil black box inside the bigger box under the hood.. the fuse is inside near the passenger door.. that you will see is blown if it is.. its a very common sense item.. basically it looks like a wire inside a peice of plastic if its blown its not connected.. Now that i think of it more if you dont hear anything from the back not even a whine im more inclinded to believe the relay or fuse is blown.. the relay i dont know how to check besides replacing it.. you would have to get it and go to an auto parts store and buy a new one and see if that fixes it.. probally under 10 bucks.. the inside cover of the black box under the hood will tell you what is what.. you want the fuel pump one.. it should say fuel on it.. __________________ www.thespeedfreaks.net For real tech help

03-28-2007, 08:58 PM	#19
BERZERKER-JEEP Registered Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 43 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Jeepkid, I replaced the relay for the fuel pump. I also check all the fuses on the panel in the dash on the passenger side. It did not cure this problem. I am not sure which fuse it is on the panel, but I checked all the ones that I could see and they were all fine. Is it safe to say that it is the pump that is the problem? I realize that it is hard to tell via internet, but I appreciate the help.

03-29-2007, 04:49 PM	#20
BERZERKER-JEEP Registered Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 43 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Update. I read the Haynes manual and I am trying to figure out how to read this multimeter while it is on the connector coming from the motor to the fuel pump. I am not sure if it is the pump because when i turn it on I can not hear anything, and I cannot get any reading on my multimeter. I don't know if I am doing anything wrong. Is there a certain way to use these meters? Thanks again..

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