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Thread: Evap System Leaks. Any Ideas?

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    Icon313 Evap System Leaks. Any Ideas?

    Anyone had any experience with leaks in the evaporative system? So far the dealer has replaced the LDP vent valve, purge solenoid, gas tank, fuel pump, a bunch of hoses, PCM, and the leak detection pump twice. Friday is the 7th trip to the dealer for this and everyone is getting a little frustrated. Does anyone have any suggestions on anything else to check? They did a smoke test during 2 trips. The first one showed the gas tank leaking and the second one showed the (new) leak detection pump was bad. Is there anything that could be causing these parts to go out? Is there anything else to check? Is there anything Chrysler might do about this? It's a 2002 WJ with 24,000 miles. Thanks

    BTW- all this has happened over the past 2 months and I've been getting either P0442, P0455, P0456 fault codes.
    2005 WK Limited/5.7L

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    if you have all three of those codes it would seem that the pcm should be replaced. not much else to replace.
    sold: 1998 jeep grand cherokee w/408 stroker with all of the trimmings.

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    I am somewhat certain that your dealer would have gone through the steps on these diagnostic sheets, but just in case, here is a file you can download that is related specifically to your DTC codes:

    DTC_P0442

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    -=- originally posted by PHANTON5.9 -=-
    if you have all three of those codes it would seem that the pcm should be replaced. not much else to replace.
    The PCM was already replaced once. Could the new one be bad too?

    -=- originally posted by milous -=-
    I am somewhat certain that your dealer would have gone through the steps on these diagnostic sheets, but just in case, here is a file you can download that is related specifically to your DTC codes:
    I'm pretty sure the dealer already did those steps.

    Is there anything that could cause all these parts to fail around the same time?
    2005 WK Limited/5.7L

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    This is probably not terribly helpful, but when my WJ threw the small evap. leak, they just had to replace the gas cap, and the code cleared. That's the first step on that diagnostic sheet, so it's probably a moot point.

    When might you be able to invoke a lemon law?
    '02 Patriot Blue WJ \ 4.7L SelecTrac
    \ Mopar skids & hooks \ OME springs & shocks \ KargoMaster Kilimanjaro Safari Rack \ 245/75/16 Goodyear Wrangler MT/R \ Rancho steering stabilizer \

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    I feel your pain, these are hard to find sometimes, there have been a few that have taken us a few trips to fix. Although, after 7, that seems excessive. There are SO many things that can leak, sometimes its hard to track it down. We had a PT crusier that had a small leak in a seam on the filler neck, that would only leak, if it was cool out, and it sat overnight.
    Dave St.Louis
    98 Platinum Gr.Cherokee 5.9 Ltd.
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    I think they replaced the gas cap with the tank and pump.

    Like my service advisor said, its not like they are just guessing and replacing random parts, it seems like every test they do shows a new leak or problem.

    Does something like this qualify for the lemon law?
    2005 WK Limited/5.7L

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    Sounds like they're going to replace the PCM again. Do you guys think 2 in a row could go bad and this is the actual problem?

    Thanks
    2005 WK Limited/5.7L

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    1800203 - FLASH: MIL ILLUMINATION FOR ERRONEOUS DTC P0456 - EVAP MONITOR SMALL LEAK DETECTED
    Date: 1/31/03

    Model Year(s): 2002-2003

    Description: NOTE: THIS BULLETIN APPLIES TO 2002-2003 WJs EQUIPPED WITH THE 4.7L ENGINE (SALES CODE EVA OR EVC). This bulletin involves selectively erasing and reprogramming the Powertrain Control Module (PCM) with new software.

    Details: The Malfunction Indicator Lamp (MIL) may illuminate due to the erroneous detection of a small leak in the vehicle’s evaporative system. The Diagnostic Trouble Code (DTC) associated with this condition is P0456 (EVAP Monitor Small Leak Detected.) No system leaks are detected when the evaporative system is tested. The DTC may be intermittent. If MIL is on and Diagnostic Trouble Code (DTC) P0456 is present, perform the Repair Procedure


    ================================================== ==




    2500102A - MIL ILLUM., DTC P0442, P0455, OR P0456 - LEAK DETECTION PUMP, LEAK DETECTED
    Date: 9/02/02 (Supercedes 2500102 dated 2/11/02)

    Model Year(s): 2002

    Description: This bulletin involves a new diagnostic test for the LDP system.

    Details: MIL illumination with one of the following DTC:
    P0442 EVAP Leak Monitor .040 Leak Detected (Medium Leak)
    P0455 EVAP Leak Monitor Large Leak Detected
    P0456 EVAP Leak Monitor .020 Leak Detected (Small Leak)
    If one of the above DTC’s are present, perform this diagnostic test first before proceeding with the diagnostic procedures in the appropriate Powertrain Diagnostic Procedure Manual.

    Raise the vehicle on an appropriate hoist. Locate the LDP vent valve. Remove the vacuum hose from the top of the vent valve (Fig. 1). Attach a hand vacuum pump to the vent valve and apply 20” Hg. vacuum. Observe the vacuum for 10 seconds. If the vacuum holds between 15.5” Hg. and 20” Hg., refer to the appropriate Powertrain Diagnostic Procedure Manual, MDS2, or the Leak Detection Pump Operation and Diagnosis booklet (Publication No. 81-170-000606) for further diagnosis. If the vacuum drops below 15.5” Hg., obtain the appropriate LDP vent valve using the Mopar parts catalog and perform the Repair Procedure.

    Repair procedure:
    1. Remove the left rear wheel.
    2. Remove the wheelhouse splash shield (five plastic rivets P/N 34201631) to gain access
    3. Remove the hose at the top rear of the evaporative canister to ease vent valve removal.
    4. Remove all clamps and all hoses attached to the vent valve.
    5. Install new vent valve. Ensure all hoses, clamps and the vacuum hose to the top of the vent valve are securely attached.
    6. Attach the hose at the top rear of the evaporative canister.
    7. Install wheelhouse splash shield using five plastic rivets.
    8. Install left rear wheel (WJ only).
    9. Lower vehicle.
    10. Use the DRBIII® to erase the DTC.

    Parts required:
    4669865 LDP vent valve
    98 GC SE 2WD L6
    02 GC LTD 4WD V8

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    Registered Moparman's Avatar
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    Never seen a PCM cause that kind of a problem on a WJ
    Dave St.Louis
    98 Platinum Gr.Cherokee 5.9 Ltd.
    3in exhaust/Flowmaster,K&N,Airbox mods,Skids,Hooks,Bilsteins,265/70/16 Toyos,Chrome 5 spoke wheels,2in BB,WJ lower arms
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    -=- originally posted by Moparman -=-
    Never seen a PCM cause that kind of a problem on a WJ
    Problem is still there so Chrysler said to replace the PCM again. Counting the original, this will make the 4th PCM thats been in the Jeep. That means that the original one went bad after a year and a half and all 3 replacements that Chrysler has sent have been defective in the exact same way. That doesn't seem right to me and I'm over $1000 in warranty claims for PCMs alone.

    I talked to a regional rep and he is going to talk to the dealer on Monday. Anyone have any ideas on what the next step might be? Thanks

    BTW- On a 2000 mile trip with the Jeep I averaged 15.2 mpg at 72 mph. Is that unusually low?
    2005 WK Limited/5.7L

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    -=- originally posted by kennedy_shane -=-
    1800203 - FLASH: MIL ILLUMINATION FOR ERRONEOUS DTC P0456 - EVAP MONITOR SMALL LEAK DETECTED
    Date: 1/31/03

    ================================================== ==




    2500102A - MIL ILLUM., DTC P0442, P0455, OR P0456 - LEAK DETECTION PUMP, LEAK DETECTED
    Date: 9/02/02 (Supercedes 2500102 dated 2/11/02)
    Been there, done that.
    2005 WK Limited/5.7L

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    Although I haven't gone to the dealer 7x, I'm having a similar issue on my 03 WJ I6. P0456 turned to 0442, and then to 0455 over a year. I replaced the gas cap and evap purge solenoid, checked all hoses and checked the canister (both fine), and had a smoke test come back w/ no leaks. Now I need to get an emissions test, and any of those codes will cause the Jeep to fail. The mechanic who did the smoke test said it could be the seal on top of the gas tank, or a rust hole in the fill neck (both of which might have a leak and still show no leaks during the smoke test). Anybody find either of these problems to be the culprit? If so, how hard is it going to be for me to a) replace the fill neck or b) drop the tank and check the seal? Thanks in advance for any replies.

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    How long before the codes return after blanking the memory?

    Most states provide for inspection waivers after you've spent a specified amount on anti-pollution repairs. We don't have inspections here anymore but when we did it was $300
    Last edited by Billy Ray; 02-28-2013 at 12:35 AM.
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    I'm waiting to see how long it takes now... 3 start-ups and no CEL yet. If I remember correctly, it should come back on after 6, though.

    Any way, I've yet to try and get it emissions tested, but the mechanic I dealt with said he could write a letter and get me a 1-year pass, which is all I need before she's sold and I buy my JK Rubicon.

    I would like to try and fix it, though... a lot easier to sell if I don't have to explain what it's going to take to just get it to pass the emissions test. So I'll reiterate my question... how bad is it going to be for me to drop the tank and replace the seal and/or fill neck? Bear in mind I'm doing this w/o a hydraulic lift and other people.

    Thanks,

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    Using no hydraulics or brawny steroid boys is a poor idea if you value you physical health.

    At the very least you will have to drive the vehicle until it, the fuel tank, is empty.

    Then you get to the problem of removing rusted fasteners with years of rust without air tools...
    -br

    Helping one another is why we are all here on Jeeps-Unlimited, or should be.
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    CEL came back today... right around 6 warm cycles as I suspected. Only came back with P0455, though. At this point, I'm just done with this evap leak problem... I'll leave it for the next owner to deal with! Lol

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