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Thread: Not coming out of 4 wheel drive when I shift into two wheel drive.

  1. #1
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    Default Not coming out of 4 wheel drive when I shift into two wheel drive.

    Last weekend at the Badlands, I had a weird problem. When I shifted from four wheel high down to two wheel high, the Jeep would pull really hard to the right when I accelerated. I had to shift the t-case back and forth a few times between the four wheel and two wheel positions before it would go back into two wheel and not pull to the right. Any ideas what this might be before I begin tearing into things I have no business getting into?

    89YJ, D30, with front disconnect
    W

  2. #2
    Mrs. Fat Tony's Husband Fat Tony's Avatar
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    Default

    I had the same problem with my XJ a few years ago...my simple solution was to replace all the tires and the problem went away immediately.

    My two front tires were worn really low compared to the back tires and for some reason it made the 4wd act exactly like you described...

    I hope this helps...might save you from tearing stuff apart...
    `08 JK Unlimited Rubicon
    `99 XJ Sport

    Previously Owned Jeeps:
    `79 CJ-7
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    `00 TJ Sahara
    `03 TJ Rubicon

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    Sounds like your 4wd system was wound up.

    What were the driving conditions where you were using 4wd-hi? Were the wheels able to slip? If not, you placed high stress on the xfer case & other components of the drive train, which could have eventually caused something to break. In your case, however, it sounds like it just would not allow the 4wd to completely disengage.

    You probably did not damage anything (this time), but in the future, do not engage 4wd in conditions where the wheels cannot slip.
    Tom

    '97 TJ Sport

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    I talk alot of chit 87JeepWrangler's Avatar
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    Icon315 posi-lock?

    did you check the vacuum for the posi-lock on the d30 yet? those are prone to problems. try putting it up on jack stands, and shifting in and out of 4wd, while checking to see if the posi-lock is engaging and disengaging properly. if it is, then it may just have been the front binding up.
    -Rob

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    Originally posted by Iceblue
    Sounds like your 4wd system was wound up.

    ......Were the wheels able to slip? If not, you placed high stress on the xfer case & other components of the drive train, which could have eventually caused something to break.
    Please tell, why would that be? Inquiring minds want to know.......
    Ron
    It's not necessary to understand things in order to argue about them.......

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    Originally posted by TJRON


    Please tell, why would that be? Inquiring minds want to know.......
    Ron
    Wind-up...

    When you are in 4WD, the front drive is locked to the rear drive by the transfer case. In part-time systems, like on the CJ & the Wranglers, there is no provision for slip between the front and the rear. The only "slack" in the system is the small gaps between the gears, etc.

    The only way your front tires and rear tires will turn exactly the same number of revolutions per mile driven is if they are exactly the same diameter (they aren't) and you drive in an precise straight line without turning your steering wheel (you obviously won't). Therefore, your rear drive will turn at a slightly different rate than your front drive. Therefore, after some distance, the transfer case gears will bind up.

    The mechanical relief under normal-use conditions for the Jeep 4WD is for the wheels to slip. When driving on dry pavement, for example, friction is so high between the tires and the pavement that the chances are the transfer case itself or some other part of the drive train will be the weak link and it will break.
    Tom

    '97 TJ Sport

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    Iceblue,
    If what you say is true, how is it that I can shift my Jeep on the fly from 2 high to 4 high at 50 mph? I would think things would "wind up" up in a heart beat. How is it I'm able to turn corners when in four wheel drive (high or low). It would seem to me I couldn't go any where but in a straight line?
    Ron
    It's not necessary to understand things in order to argue about them.......

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    Geezer Jeeper Jerry Bransford's Avatar
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    TJRON definitely knows all about what windup is, it's just that the original poster never said he was on pavement when it happened. Except very rarely on smooth rock surfaces, windup isn't a problem encountered offroad.
    See the Geezer Jeep http://www.greentractortalk.com/jerryb/index.htm
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    Jerry,
    Actually I don't understand "wind up". I've never had it happen to me and I run all over the Moab slick rock in 4 wheel drive. I've mistakenly put it in 4 high on the highway and only found it more difficult to steer during turns, and I figuered that was due to the Detroit in the front.
    Maybe you could help out here?
    Thanks,
    Ron
    It's not necessary to understand things in order to argue about them.......

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    Originally posted by TJRON
    Jerry,
    Actually I don't understand "wind up". I've never had it happen to me and I run all over the Moab slick rock in 4 wheel drive. I've mistakenly put it in 4 high on the highway and only found it more difficult to steer during turns, and I figuered that was due to the Detroit in the front.
    Maybe you could help out here?
    Thanks,
    Ron
    Me too, unless it has something to do with mobil 1 , just wondering out loud. Jim
    97tj, I6, 5speed 4to1 HP44F, Warns, CTM's, Detroit & 538's, 9inchR ,Strange Nod & spool, 35 spline Mossers & 543's
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    What I say is true. That is why the mismatched front and rear tires caused it to happen relatively quickly. The Jeep Wrangler 4WD is a part time 4WD, despite the shift-on-the-fly feature. Read your manual - it'll tell you not to drive in 4WD on dry pavement.

    It won't usually happen "in a heart beat" - in fact, you may find you can drive several miles, since somethings you do (e.g. turn left) will cause it to tighten while doing the opposite (e.g. turn right) will loosen it again. Also, you probably won't actually break anything. Probably what will happen is the xfer case will bind up and you won't be able to get it out of 4WD, or the Jeep will begin to have it's handling go to crap, maybe even seem to buck and lurch a bit, as the tires try to slip on the pavement.

    If you are off road, you usually don't have to worry, since even dry rock usually has sand, gravel, etc., that will provide enough slip or it is a smooth surface, unlike pavement. You normally don't even notice the small wheel slips under these conditions.

    Its only when driving on dry pavement, or similar high friction surfaces, that the system will wind up and you even notice anything unusual.
    Tom

    '97 TJ Sport

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    Originally posted by Jerry Bransford
    TJRON definitely knows all about what windup is, it's just that the original poster never said he was on pavement when it happened. Except very rarely on smooth rock surfaces, windup isn't a problem encountered offroad.
    I should have clarified where I was at when it was giving me the problem I was in some sand/pebble mix. Anyone who has visited the Badlands knows what I mean. There was plenty of "slippage" on the terrain I was on when I shifted from 4hi down to 2 hi. I didn't really notice the problem until I hit the blacktop. The blacktop that I was driving on was the reason I shifted into 2hi. The first time I accelerated on the blacktop, it jerked really hard to the right. I should also mention that I have an EZ Locker in the front, just in case that might have anything to do with it.
    W

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    Icon315

    Craig,

    When you mentioned "D30, with front disconnect", are you saying you still have the stock vacuum disconnect system in place? I know you run a 350cid V8, but not sure about your trans & t-case set-up, or if a NP231 is still there helping with vacuum disco duties.

    Does your 4wd dash indicator still work?

    You may want to check all the vacuum connections & see if some are loose/damaged/kinked, & take a close look at the connector on top of the t-case & also at the axle disco (if you still have the factory system).

    Let us know what you find.

    EDIT: I just saw your above post after posting. I'll read & see what I think.

    Joe

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    Originally posted by Joe Dillard
    Craig,

    When you mentioned "D30, with front disconnect", are you saying you still have the stock vacuum disconnect system in place? I know you run a 350cid V8, but not sure about your trans & t-case set-up, or if a NP231 is still there helping with vacuum disco duties.

    Does your 4wd dash indicator still work?

    You may want to check all the vacuum connections & see if some are loose/damaged/kinked, & take a close look at the connector on top of the t-case & also at the axle disco (if you still have the factory system).

    Let us know what you find.

    EDIT: I just saw your above post after posting. I'll read & see what I think.

    Joe
    Joe, yes, the D30 is still intact, in stock form. My indicator light hasn't worked since I got it. When I looked at it after wheeling, it all looked good. I do need to do a thorough inspection of the entire system. This has been a bad week for Jeep maintainance. Actually, in all honesty, I parked the Jeep in the garage Saturday night, and haven't seen it since. This has been a really bad week, and nothing but my job got done this week. The reason I asked the initial question was so I could get some feedback before everyone took off for the weekend. I plan to spend all day Sunday fixing and repairing all of the stuff that got bruised last weekend.
    W

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    I realize I shouldn't drive on pavement in 4 high but wouldn't the open differentials provide some give?
    Ron
    It's not necessary to understand things in order to argue about them.......

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    Obviously, the problem Craig had was not windup, since he was driving on sand/gravel. Unless, of course, he drove for a while on pavement before trying to shift out of 4WD.

    Originally posted by TJRON
    I realize I shouldn't drive on pavement in 4 high but wouldn't the open differentials provide some give?
    Ron
    The differentials provide left-to-right slippage, but not front-to-back. There are transfer cases that do provide front-to-back slippage (e.g. on the Grand Cherokee's full-time system), but part-time systems do not. That is why they are called part-time. The part-time systems are better for off-road use; the full-time systems are better for winter driving on public roads.
    Tom

    '97 TJ Sport

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    Default Check your transfer case linkages

    You might have a loose transfer case linkage or one that has come out of adjustment. On the 231's, they have a rod that is held in adjustment with a bolt. It can work its way out of adjustment during flex. That is *not* the best method of keeping something from coming loose in my opinion......

    The only other thing I could think of is that you were getting interference between the body and the shifter lever. This could be because of linkage misadjustment, wear, flex between the body and frame, body lifts, or even worn out mounts on the tranny/transfer case.

    You might consider one of those AA relocation brackets that connects the tx lever to the tx only -- not between the body and tx. Then goober the bolt up good with some loctite -- *just to make sure*

    Best regards

    John
    "Misinformation is exactly like regular information, except wrong." Dilbert

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    Ice Blue,
    If we have left and right slippage on each axle, it would seem the spider gears can select the wheel to be "driven" and release the wheel that is trying to "windup" the drive train. Maybe this constant "action" would be bad for the spiders and cause the pumpkins to heat up, I dunno......
    Any how, thanks for the discussion!
    Ron
    It's not necessary to understand things in order to argue about them.......

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    The transfer case mechanically must turn the front and rear drive shafts in lock-step. The front and rear diffs allow the left and right wheels to turn at different speeds, but they do not allow the drive shaft to stop turning; one wheel or the other must be turning so the left-to-right slip in the diff doesn’t relieve wind up in the transfer case.
    Tom

    '97 TJ Sport

  20. #20

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    Originally posted by Iceblue
    Read your manual - it'll tell you not to drive in 4WD on dry pavement.

    If you are off road, you usually don't have to worry, since even dry rock usually has sand, gravel, etc., that will provide enough slip or it is a smooth surface, unlike pavement. You normally don't even notice the small wheel slips under these conditions.

    Its only when driving on dry pavement, or similar high friction surfaces, that the system will wind up and you even notice anything unusual.
    I would suggest that the sandstone that makes up most of Moab has a much higher friction coefficient than most pavements and yet we see all kinds of Jeeps running around there without blowing up the t-case.

    I will even go so far to say that even alot of the granite and lava based rock that we drive on out in Johnson Valley along with very grippy tires aired down to 7psi provides a level of friction equal to that found on most roadways. We in fact work very hard not to slip tires in order to stay on a line that may have only a 1" margin of error and I have yet to find any fragged t-cases laying about out there. Thats not to say it doesn't happen but I also think you are blowing what goes on with that t-case way out of proportion.

    The 231 is alot more durable than most people give it credit for. The manual is there for idiots and to protect DC from warranty claims resulting from them.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jodean View Post
    Keep telling me how dumb i am i guess.......dont make me any difference to me, i know better, too smart for my own good.

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