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View Full Version : Rear view mirror w/lights from S10 - need wiring info



lynn
08-27-2002, 09:29 AM
A buddy of mine picked up a mirror for me from an S10 Blazer at the boneyard, while I was in CA on business.
This mirror has a light on each side along the bottom of the mirror, each light with it's own switch. I suspect that these lights came on automatically when the door was opened, and also could be switched on from inside when the doors were closed. At least that's the way they work in my '99 S10 ZR2. (This mirror is from an earlier 90's S10)

Master John, do you have any info on the wiring for this?
Obviously, I don't need the door-open feature ;) , I just want to be able to switch them on and off as needed after I install this mirror in my courtesy-light-challenged CJ5.
There are 4 wires going into this unit: White, Yellow, Orange and Black.

Thanks for any help/suggestions.

John Strenk
08-27-2002, 09:29 AM
This is good info.
Is there anything in the way the mirror lights work between having the car running or not? Maybe the light switches dont work when the ignition is off But the door switch turns them on all the time ???

Oh yeah, don't connect your ignition wire to your battery lead going into the mirror. Then you wont be able to turn the engine off because it will be bypassing the ignition switch. If we have to we could add a diode if we have to.

ChiliPepperTJ
08-27-2002, 09:59 AM
Lynn,
I had one of these in my 87 s-10 blazer, I had put it in. The one I had only had 2 wires though, just a hot and a groung. I would say use the black as a groung and touch each one of the other wires to a 12V source and see if the lights come on. Then you can just cover the other 2 you aren't using w/ electrical tape. HTH
Kevin

lynn
08-27-2002, 10:02 AM
That's what I was thinking I would do if I couldn't get the factory wiring details. Thanks for the suggestion Kevin.

John Strenk
08-27-2002, 10:09 AM
Not the exact wiring but hmm... 4 wires, two lights, two switches. My guess would be 1 wire is power (12volts), One wire would be ground( for the switches inside the mirror, the other 2 wires go to the door switches assuming one light per each open door.

I would take an ohm meter and check across each pair of wires looking for continunity. I would guess Black is ground, Orange is plus 12volts, the other two for door switches. if you have one wire that doesn't connect to anything when both switches are off then that is ground. If you pull out the lights and close both switches then thats the power connector. You wont need the other two.

http://www.dana60.com/76cj5/MirrorLight.jpg

Of course of both lights come on when a door is open or if they come on when the dash lights are turned all the way up then that throws my thinking off completly.

This is just a quess

I would take a 12 volt battery and quickly touch each pair together and see if it sparks or turns the light on :D

John Strenk
08-27-2002, 10:10 AM
I got to learn to type faster :D

lynn
08-27-2002, 10:18 AM
In my truck, both lights come on when either door is opened. But I don't know if it has the same 4 wire set-up.
And I'm not going to tear it apart to check :D

I was thinking that I could do my testing with a battery charger, set on 2A or 10A, just for the test. This was the method described by Painless to test my harness after installation before hooking up the battery. Do you think it would be a good idea to use this method instead of testing direct from the battery?

toluan
08-27-2002, 10:26 AM
Lynn,
What is the name of the company that makes the mirror? I have to take a look @ mine for the color match to yours...

lynn
08-27-2002, 10:28 AM
Luan, there's a name on it, but I can't recall it now, and the unit is at home. I'll check tonight and advise tommorrow.

John Strenk
08-27-2002, 10:29 AM
Originally posted by lynn
In my truck, both lights come on when either door is opened. But I don't know if it has the same 4 wire set-up.
And I'm not going to tear it apart to check :D

I was thinking that I could do my testing with a battery charger, set on 2A or 10A, just for the test. This was the method described by Painless to test my harness after installation before hooking up the battery. Do you think it would be a good idea to use this method instead of testing direct from the battery?

Set it on 2A, No sense in heating up the wire to fast if it turns out to be a short. The battery might give you 200A quickly in a short. Look for sparking or look at the meter on the charger to see if you have current flowing and no lights on.

Also make sure you can turn the lights off and on with the switch. :)

lynn
08-27-2002, 10:46 AM
Thanks :)

I'll post results when I can get back to this little project. If I don't get to it tonight, I may not have time until next week.

FLCJ8
08-27-2002, 04:55 PM
I don't know if this is true, but, I have read that one of the wires is tied to the backup lights, to turn the interior lights off when the vehicle is in reverse!? I haven't figured out why this would be needed, unless it's a government safety issue.

lynn
08-28-2002, 08:38 AM
OK, I applied some current to this unit last night.

First I can confirm that both lights work :)
But not exactly the way I want them to...:confused:

I hooked up my battery charger, set it on 2A. I ran a jumper from the negative clamp to the black wire. Then touched the positive clamp to the orange wire. Both lamps lit!! :D
I had both switches in the "on" position. I turned them off. No change, both lamps remain lit :(
I tried the positive clamp on both the yellow and the white wire(separately). No light, no sparks, nada.

Repeated process, same result.

Master John, can you provide diagnosis from this data??

In response to Luan's inquiry, this unit is a Donnelly, model 263.0.
There are some other number codes on the unit that I can provide if needed.

Again, TIA for any input on how to wire this unit.

John Strenk
08-28-2002, 09:11 AM
Hmmm.... Lynn, go into your truck and close the door and turn on one light. Then open the door and see if the light get's brighter. Then do it the other way, Leave the door open, then turn the switch on and see if it gets brighter.

I'm thinking that they might have a couple of diodes in the circuit. This will drop the voltage about 0.6 volts and make it a little dimmer. What I'm getting at is if the voltage was reversed when you hooked up the battery charger, than the diodes would conduct all the time.

Repeate your battery charger test with the (+) and (-) leads reversed.

toluan
08-28-2002, 09:50 AM
Lynn my boy here is the exact written text that I got from an engineer from Donnelly via email:

"...now that I know that the mirror does have the four pin connector on the back of the case. Looking at the back of the mirror, the pin in the lower left corner goes to the door switch. upper left is ground, upper right is battery, and lower right is ignition. If the mirror does not seam to work
right, then reverse the battery and ground. This is because some were built for Fords and Corvettes, which have a positive door switch. All others have a door switch which goes to ground.

Yes, the door switch will override the "off" position of the switch.
The mirror serves the function of a dome lamp when a door opens.

The extra black wire could go to a microphone in the corner of the
mirror, or an LED in the bottom of the case, or some other added function that I am not aware of. Look for an led or a snap-in holder of any kind visible on the exterior of the mirror. The extra
wire will pertain to that.

There are no added markings to identify what vehicle the mirror came
out of."

Note: I cannot confirm this because I have not had the chance to connect everything(still working on my cage). Hell I don't even know where my wiring harness is?! I wonder it is in my garage or is it in my console:rolleyes:...
Good luck.

P.S. you have no idea how hard it was to get these Donnelli's guys to talk...my exact words to the V. President of the company was, "You guys make how many mirrors and don't have a customer support section?! Do you know how many 4x4 and jeepers use your mirrors via the yard?" before I got some results!

lynn
08-28-2002, 10:33 AM
Originally posted by toluan
Lynn my boy here is the exact written text that I got from an engineer from Donnelly via email:

"...now that I know that the mirror does have the four pin connector on the back of the case. Looking at the back of the mirror, the pin in the lower left corner goes to the door switch. upper left is ground, upper right is battery, and lower right is ignition. If the mirror does not seam to work
right, then reverse the battery and ground. This is because some were built for Fords and Corvettes, which have a positive door switch. All others have a door switch which goes to ground.

Yes, the door switch will override the "off" position of the switch.
The mirror serves the function of a dome lamp when a door opens.

The extra black wire could go to a microphone in the corner of the
mirror, or an LED in the bottom of the case, or some other added function that I am not aware of. Look for an led or a snap-in holder of any kind visible on the exterior of the mirror. The extra
wire will pertain to that.

There are no added markings to identify what vehicle the mirror came
out of."

Note: I cannot confirm this because I have not had the chance to connect everything(still working on my cage). Hell I don't even know where my wiring harness is?! I wonder it is in my garage or is it in console:rolleyes:...
Good luck.

P.S. you have no idea how hard it was to get these Donnelli's guys to talk...my exact words to the V. President of the company was, "You guys make how many mirrors and don't have a customer support section?! Do you know how many 4x4 and jeepers use your mirrors via the yard?" before I got some results!

Luan, very cool that we found the same unit! I'm glad you took the initiative to contact the manufacturer and weasel some info from them. Give me their email, I'll send them a note letting them know that you were accurate in telling them their stuff lives on in the 4x4 world after the original vehicle dies... ;)
John, sounds like your thought is exactly what the guy at Donnelly said, to swap the +/-.
OK, since mine came from an S10 blazer, the door switch would be negative. Since it is not grounded during my test, it is like the door is open, so it overrides the off position of the switch. If I run the door switch wire also to ground, it should allow the switch to control the off position. Right?
Then, what about the wire to ignition? Should I run that to the same hot source as the battery wire? Why would it have to go to ignition (switched)?
BTW, mine has no extra wire, only the 4 mentioned.

Using the description of the pin locations described above, I'm thinking I want to run the black to ground, as well as the door switch wire. Then connect both the battery and ignition wire to my positive lead.
If that doesn't work right, I would swap the ground and battery wires.
What do you guys think of this approach? Sound good?
Thanks!!

lynn
08-28-2002, 11:10 AM
I think in my truck I can turn the mirror lights on without having the ignition on. I'll have to check after work.

I wasn't hooking up the Jeep's ignition wire to the battery wire in the mirror, I was going to hook up the wire that the mirror has for ignition, to the same source I will use for battery.
Essentially twist those two together at the mirror and just connect them to a hot wire.

Hmmm, I bet I don't need to use the wire that the mirror has for ignition. Probably just tape that one off, as I will want my lights hot all the time.

John Strenk
08-28-2002, 01:57 PM
Based on the new info Tolaun gave us. This is one diagram that will fill all the information we received.

This takes into effect the results of your testing last night and the fact that the leads are for Batt, Ign, Door, Ground and will work with either grounding type switch on the door or Power type switch on the door on different makes and models of cars.

http://www.dana60.com/76cj5/MirrorLight2.jpg

On your application you probably don't need the ignition lead hooked up. That lead is only for cars that have the power switched off and on at the door.

Hooking it up to the battery and door switch terminals will not switch the lights off or on as you found out last night. Neither will hooking it up to the Ign. You would need to have the ground lead hooked up to turn the lights off and on and the door switch to turn both on when the door is open.

Confused yet?? :D This was as simple as I could figure it.

lynn
08-28-2002, 03:35 PM
Your drawing makes sense John, according to the info from Luan and tracing the path in my head.

Nevermind, I was tracing a rust spot on my contact lenses :rolleyes:
:D ;)

I'll test it tonight and report tommorrow. Thanks for making that drawing, I'm betting some other folks will be putting it to use, too. :)

John Brereton
08-28-2002, 04:41 PM
Sounds like a nice mod but I have one question. How will you run the wires on the windshield? My CJ5 has the rear veiw mirror mounted no the glass, no the frame.

lynn
08-28-2002, 04:55 PM
I have a full cage, with the CB mounted between two center stringers. I run power to the CB up the leg of the cage (under the padding, taped to the cage leg) and up to the top. I'll do the same for this mirror, the wires will only have to bridge the 2" space between the front hoop and the windshield.

My current mirror is mounted to the frame, as would be stock in '71. This one will be glued to the glass. I never fold my windshield due to windshield-mounted offroad lights, so that isn't a concern. I could put connectors in line, if I had a need to separate them to fold the windshield.

John Strenk
08-28-2002, 05:32 PM
Originally posted by lynn
My current mirror is mounted to the frame, as would be stock in '71.


You got one of these also then. :)
http://www.dana60.com/76cj5/miror.jpg

I tried to explain it to the guy who builds CB Racks but I don't think he was intersted in making a custom mount. :(

lynn
08-29-2002, 08:51 AM
:)

My wires, according to the info from Donnelly (posted by Luan) are:
White - door switch
Yellow - Ignition
Orange - Battery
Black - Ground

Last night I tried a variety of combinations. Mostly ignoring the ignition wire and working with the door switch wire.

Here's the combination that finally worked:
Twist the yellow and orange together, apply positive lead from the charger.
Apply negative lead to the black wire.
Ignore the white door switch wire (taped it off)
:D
This combination allows each light to be turned on/off with the individual switches.
Sometime next week I'll run the wiring, then remove the old mirror and drive to my local glass shop. I'll have them install their professional-grade sticky stuff for $5, and they'll fix for free if it ever comes off. :)

John, my mirror mount is different. It's a block about 2" square (shiney, maybe aluminum) that fits against the frame, with a plate held to it by two screws. This sandwiches the edge of the frame and holds it tight, without having holes drilled in the frame.
At least that's how it appears, I'll know more when I take it off. It is definitely not like the one pictured above. I didn't mess with it last night, I caught a cold :mad: from those damn airlines that claimed on nightly news last week that airplanes do not increase your risk of catching a cold by recirculating the air. Lyin' bastages, I feel like crap... :mad:

Big THANKS!! to John and Luan for helping me figure out this wiring. I think this will be a handy mod, and I hope this post helps someone else in the future.
:)

John Strenk
08-29-2002, 09:03 AM
Great!! Now wasn't there someone on here that said he could get a bunch of them for cheap ??? I sure could of used one this morning.

Also, what do you think about moving the epoxied window mount up higher? When I tried to put a mirror on my window in the stock location it always blocked my view. Being 6'3" I alway tried to ram the thing up as high as I could but it was always in the way.

I think the best way I drove it was when it fell off and didn't have a rear view mirror for about a week. "What's behind me isn't important!":D

lynn
08-29-2002, 10:16 AM
John, on mine, it looks like I'll be gluing the piece to the glass at the very top of the glass for my best fit (I'm only 5'8" :) ). For me. gluing it any higher (ie: onto the frame) would be too high

Jerry8
12-03-2014, 12:18 AM
:)

My wires, according to the info from Donnelly (posted by Luan) are:
White - door switch
Yellow - Ignition
Orange - Battery
Black - Ground

Last night I tried a variety of combinations. Mostly ignoring the ignition wire and working with the door switch wire.

Here's the combination that finally worked:
Twist the yellow and orange together, apply positive lead from the charger.
Apply negative lead to the black wire.
Ignore the white door switch wire (taped it off)
:D
This combination allows each light to be turned on/off with the individual switches.
Sometime next week I'll run the wiring, then remove the old mirror and drive to my local glass shop. I'll have them install their professional-grade sticky stuff for $5, and they'll fix for free if it ever comes off. :)

John, my mirror mount is different. It's a block about 2" square (shiney, maybe aluminum) that fits against the frame, with a plate held to it by two screws. This sandwiches the edge of the frame and holds it tight, without having holes drilled in the frame.
At least that's how it appears, I'll know more when I take it off. It is definitely not like the one pictured above. I didn't mess with it last night, I caught a cold :mad: from those damn airlines that claimed on nightly news last week that airplanes do not increase your risk of catching a cold by recirculating the air. Lyin' bastages, I feel like crap... :mad:

Big THANKS!! to John and Luan for helping me figure out this wiring. I think this will be a handy mod, and I hope this post helps someone else in the future.
:)

Here's the proper combination that finally worked:
Twist the yellow and orange together, apply negative/ground lead from the charger.
Apply positive lead to the black wire.
Switches work for the respective lights.
There is a function for the white wire. I had the same problem with a rear view mirror I picked up. Used the mirror to fit onto a 1986 corvette.
The white wire is wired to the door jambs (I fitted a pair, one to each door). The jambs are wired back to the black. When any door is opened, both lights go on.